Liberty University to consider concealed weapons on campus
File Photo by Jill Nance/The News & Advance
Two Liberty University students sit on the steps of DeMoss Hall last month. LU officials say they will consider whether concealed weapons permit holders will be allowed to carry guns on campus.
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By Christa Desrets
Published: October 9, 2008
Liberty University will consider whether to allow concealed weapon permit holders to carry guns on campus at its next board of trustees meeting, Chancellor Jerry Falwell Jr. said Thursday.
If it adopted the policy change, Liberty would become one nearly a dozen colleges nationally to allow concealed weapons on campus, according to Students for Concealed Carry on Campus.
Falwell said he decided to bring the matter before the board for discussion after members of Liberty’s chapter of SCCC requested it.
“We just have a group on campus that’s been promoting that idea, and I really don’t have a good feel for whether our community would support it or not,” Falwell said. “So I just decided to take it to the board.”
Currently the university does not allow those with concealed weapons permits to carry a gun on campus, he said.
The board of trustees has 38 members, including Falwell and his brother Jonathan. The next meeting is in early March.
The body may not make a decision on the issue, Falwell said, but will at least consider it.
“I want to make sure that we look at it long and hard before we make a decision,” he said.
“Between now and the board meeting, we’ll have RAs (resident advisers) talking to students and see what they think about it.”
Falwell also has not formed an opinion on the issue, he said.
Liberty senior Ben Neiman, leader of Liberty’s chapter of SCCC, said the group has more than 300 members, mostly students, staff and faculty.
Nationally, the organization has more than 30,000 members at hundreds of schools.
“These are people who already have their concealed carry permits, and you mingle with them in movie theaters and shopping malls around town anyways,” Neiman said. “We’re just all about our own safety. We realize that campuses are generally safe, but in the off chance that we are threatened, we want to be able to defend ourselves.”
Utah is the only state that does not allow any of its nine public universities to restrict people from carrying concealed weapons on campus.
According to the SCCC, Colorado State University and Blue Ridge Community College in Weyers Cave, Va., are the only other schools that allow concealed carry on campus.
In Virginia, where one must be at least 21 years old to apply for a concealed handgun permit, each college can decide whether to allow guns on campus.
Leading up to the meeting in March, Falwell said board members have much to consider, such as how difficult the process is to get a permit to carry.
He also hopes to ask students and faculty for their opinions, and learn more about the arguments from both sides of the issue.
“I understand all the concern about security, and that’s why I’m even going to mention it to the board,” Falwell said.
“If the board thinks that would enhance security, then it might be something they would be in favor of.”
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Reader Reactions
Posted by ( kristyne87 ) on October 13, 2008 at 4:33 pm
TJ57 I LOVE the facts, because I myself am still not certain about CC on campus, especially by students. When the arguments are filled with cited facts its easier to have a logical debate on which would be actually better.
Thank you Cosmos for admitting your actual question, and I think I had read that in a few earlier posts with Jero…but now I really see it. “ I just find it curious that people who claim it’s better when you are dead are SO afraid for their lives. It would ALL be God’s will ANYWAY”
Okay so, yes, as a Christian, I do believe that Heaven is a very real place that those who have faith in Christ get to, and that it is a much much better place than Earth.
But the issue is not necessarily being afraid for their lives, afraid people hide in holes, concerned activists do something about it. I mean lets look at the reason why people become police officers. Is it because they are afraid of crime, or because they sense a better calling to protect others, and therefore put themselves in harms way. They are very unafraid. And I believe that anyone who would wish to conceal carry is far braver than another who may not. It means that that person is responsible for the fact that if there is some sort of disturbance in their vicinity, then they should go towards the conflict and risk their own lives, as opposed to run away and hide.
Therefore I believe that more of those Faculty would wish not only to protect their own lives, but rather to protect those around them and to stop a potential situation like school shootings. Or perhaps they would carry because they would feel like a victim, like a target.
God is sovereign, i.e. yes in control over everything, but human free will still plays into that. For example…I could walk in front of a bus and end my life…but that wouldn’t be God’s plan for my life…that would be a waste. God is not only interested in restoring an eternal relationship, but He is highly interested in our lives on Earth. Jesus said that He came that we might have life and have it abundantly. God wants us to enjoy this life and to tell others about Him, but to realize that Heaven is our more important home.
When making decisions the Bible highly cites using wisdom, this can be used in this situation. In today’s society with the shootings and the rampant crime, I believe that God would want everyone (even non Christians) to protect themselves against potential harm. That is simply the sad state of things.
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Posted by ( TJackson57 ) on October 13, 2008 at 2:30 pm
Cosmo, the Kleck (not Gleck) study found DGUs amounted to 2,000,000.
As I said, if you don’t like his numbers, you can look at the Department of Justice Study here: http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/165476.pdf
They found 1,500,000.
And congratulations on realizing a fact. Many crimes are not prosecuted. In fact, some are not even reported.
That being said, you seem to vastly underestimate the amount of crime that exists in the United States. According to the FBI there were 11,251,818 crimes reported in the United States in 2007. (How many more were unreported?) Of those 11,251,818 there were more than 1,400,000 violent crimes.
Crime is real. CCW allows individuals to defend themselves against the most dangerous among us.
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Posted by ( redstone ) on October 13, 2008 at 2:20 pm
Cosmo,
I have a friend like you that says crazy stuff just because he likes setting people off.
and I qoute The Cosmo “ I just find it curious that people who claim it’s better when you are dead are SO afraid for their lives. It would ALL be God’s will ANYWAY! “
Did you just suggest all who believe in an afterlife and heaven should be ok with being murdered? I think its an interesting position, I was just wondering if you wanted to explain it so we could share in the wisdom of the Cosmo. Since you did not reference “dying for ones faith” I assume you just mean in general we should feel this way. IM not kidding, I really want to hear you defend this one.
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Posted by ( luv2bliberal ) on October 13, 2008 at 1:47 pm
Cozmo wrong? Say it ain’t so!
Did you also know he is almost never right? That is what happens when you go through life uneducated.
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Posted by ( TJackson57 ) on October 13, 2008 at 1:43 pm
Cosmo said: “The shooter WAS a Christian!“
Actually, that isn’t true. He was brought up in a Christian home, but he bitterly hated Christians. In one of his rambling hate filled message he posted on the internet, he said: “I’m coming for EVERYONE soon and I WILL be armed to the ...teeth and I WILL shoot to kill. ...God, I can’t wait till I can kill you people. Feel no remorse, no sense of shame, I don’t care if I live or die in the shoot-out. All I want to do is kill and injure as many of you ... as I can especially Christians who are to blame for most of the problems in the world.“
Perhaps you should have done a bit of investigation? Perhaps you should have investigated statements of the law enforcement officials involved in the case, who pointed out that the shooting was motivated by Anti-Christian Bias.
In case you don’t know, one is not a Christian by virtue of being brought up in a Christian home. Just as one might not be an Atheist by virtue of being brought up on a secular household.
I understand that you have an agenda, but you really need to get your head out of the clouds and snap back to reality.
Cosmo said: “Give us stats: How many people are shot and or killed accidentally by handguns in America? How many crazy shooters are stopped by “CC” Dirty Harry wanna-be Rambos?“
University of Florida Criminal Justice Professor, Gary Kleck conducted a study which showed defensive gun uses occur 2,000,000 per year. The United States Department of Justice (using a smaller sample size) put the number at 1,500,000. In the overwhelming majority of the DGUs a gun never has to be fired. Merely brandishing the gun is enough to stop the criminal act.
So, let’s use the smaller DOJ number for sake of argument. 1,500,000.
By contrast, there are only about 600 accidental firearm deaths per year.
Let’s put that number into perspective. Accidental firearm deaths fall behind Automobiles (43,000) Falls (16,200) Poisoning (12,100) Pedestrian Accidents (5,300) Drowning (3,900) Fires (3,600) Suffocation (3,400).
1,500,000 vs. 600.
That’s 1,500,000 individuals who may have been murdered, raped, robbed, or assaulted had it not been for the defensive use of firearms.
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Posted by ( redstone ) on October 13, 2008 at 1:40 pm
I think it interesting that people argue against personal protection? Folk who are bent on harming others are going to respect no policy or posted sign. I believe that CC citizens have more than proven that they are capable and competent.
Some will vent and rant about why we shouldnt, or even why we dont need to carry. And I would agree IF a Police Officer was stationed nearby. But they arent, and if something terrible starts to happen I doubt the wrong doer will wait patiently for help to arrive.
I vote we be allowed to defend ourselves just like any other citizen in Virginia. Kudo’s to the Chancelor for having the kahones to even bring this to the board.
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Posted by ( asforme ) on October 13, 2008 at 12:59 pm
Estimated guns in the United States: 275 million (roughly).
Estimated swimming pools in the United States: 2.5 million (roughly - according to Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy, 2004)
Unintentional firearm deaths ages 0-14 (according to the CDC) from 2000 to 2005: 412.
Unintentional drowning deaths from 2000 to 2005 ages 0-14: 4,993.
If you want to protect people from accidental death, ban pools.
There are 2.5 million defensive uses of firearms in America each year. The event of a mass shooting is very rare, it is the everyday violent crime that is a more relevant focus. Defending against rape, assault and violent theft are extremely important.
With only 10,500 students LU had 4 forcible sex offences last year. BYU with it’s 30,000 students, and with the protected right to carry concealed handguns, had ZERO! Guns save lives even when they’re not used because the knowledge that potential victims are armed is a huge deterrent.
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Posted by ( TJackson57 ) on October 13, 2008 at 11:57 am
Without exception, each time a State or Locality talks about easing restrictions on carrying concealed weapons we hear the same old “There will be blood in the streets.“ “People will be shooting each other over parking spaces.“ “It will be the wild-west.“ “Young people aren’t responsible enough to carry.“ “There will be accidental shootings!“
In every instance, they have been wrong. Today, 40 States are “Right-to-carry.“ Two States Alaska and Vermont allow carry WITHOUT a permit.
The hysterical responses by those who usually know nothing about guns have been proven wrong in EVERY circumstance.
But we DO have examples of CCW permit holders stopping mass shootings. Some of these have even happened here in Virginia.
The fact of the matter is that there are some crazy people out there who hate Christians. The shooter at the New Life Church in Colorado specifically went there to kill Christians.
Had it not been for Jeanne Assam, a CCW holder armed with her personal weapon, he could have killed dozens. (He had more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition, an AR-15 rifle and 2 handguns.)
As a Law Enforcement Officer, I must point out that CCW SAVES LIVES!
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Posted by ( TJackson57 ) on October 13, 2008 at 11:45 am
As a full time law enforcement officer, I am strongly in favor of colleges allowing CCW permit holders to carry on campus. In order for a person to obtain a Virgina CCW permit, they must undergo a criminal background investigation, have their mental health records checked, pass a CCW training course, and be fingerprinted.
The fact of the matter is that law enforcement cannot be everywhere at once. CCW holders can save lives. In the Colorado Church Shooting, a CCW permit holder saved dozens of individuals from being killed.
People seem to forget that if a criminal decides to kill a bunch of people in a mass shooting, they are not going to care about any CCW policy that a school has in place. The only ones who abide by the policy are the law-abiding individuals who will become the defenseless victims of the crazy shooter.
In law enforcement rapid deployment training, officers are taught that every second equals a life, every shot that is fired can mean another dead student. Even with on campus police, a shooter can fire dozens of rounds before anyone can call for help, much less get a police response on scene.
If a CCW permit holder is on the scene, they may well be able to end the shooting immediately. In 2002, At the Appalachian School of Law, a shooter was finally stopped after a CCW permit holder retrieved his weapon from his car. In the time that it took for the CCW holder to get his weapon, 3 people were already dead. Had the CCW permit holder been allowed to carry, the shooting could have been stopped much earlier.
CCW permit holders are ordinary Americans who have decided to take responsibility for their own defense. They are among the most law abiding groups of people in the nation.
Liberty should allow CCW permit holders to carry on campus. After all, we are living in an increasingly crazy society. What if some criminal psycho decides that taking out some “evil evangelicals” might further their cause? If CCW holders were permitted to carry on campus, those individuals might think twice about doing so.
Criminals seek out easy targets. They do not want to face potentially armed targets. As such, CCW provides a strong deterrent factor even if a permit holder never has to use a weapon.
People need to remember that CCW permit holders work with you, eat with you, interact with you each and every day in the general community. Most of the time you won’t even know that they are armed.
Allowing CCW on campus makes sense, and I hope Liberty allows it.
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Posted by ( jero1987 ) on October 13, 2008 at 10:16 am
“If my neighbor believed half of the nonsense they teach at Liberty I wouldn’t really feel comfortable around him if he had a really sharp point on his pencil…. let alone a loaded gun. “
Well guess what the best part about living in America is Cosmo? I could care less how comfortable you feel. This is America and I have the rights to carry no matter what my religion is. If my neighbor is Christian, Hindu, Muslim, Morman, (insert any religion here), or Atheist, he/she can defense themselves and their family. So your opinions on Liberty and or what makes you uncomfortable is meaningless. Thanks for the insight on your personal life, but keep it out of the debate.
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